It would be a terrible idea to put tree frogs in crab tank

This is where you discuss the conditions of your crabitat -- temperature, humidity, substrate, decorating, etc.
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It would be a terrible idea to put tree frogs in crab tank

Post by Guest » Wed Jul 25, 2007 10:39 am

right?

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Jedediah
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Post by Jedediah » Wed Jul 25, 2007 10:53 am

Yes. There was a case of a crabber losing almost all crabs to a disease the crabs got from tree frogs at the pet shop (I can't for the live of me find that thread, it was ages ago).
Apart from that, finding a frog that has 100% the same needs as the crabs is hard and frogs and crabs may stress each other. The crabs will climb all over the sleeping frogs during the day and the frogs may decide to try what crab tastes like - they go for anything that moves. If your enclosure is really big, it's possible to create microclimates for both species and they can avoid each other, but IMO all the standard tanks are too small for that. I wouldn't co-house even small species in anything smaller than 6 ft long by 3 ft high.
Last edited by Jedediah on Thu Jul 26, 2007 2:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by hulk » Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:27 pm

I agree that mixing species is not a great idea.
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Post by JediMasterThrash » Wed Jul 25, 2007 7:01 pm

I remember that. Didn't the disease make the crabs look drunk? I remember they posted a video of the crab trying to get up and walk, and it kept stumbling around, and couldn't keep itself upright.
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Post by Guest » Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:51 pm

right.


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Post by Guest » Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:58 pm

Moved to crabitat conditions by crabber. :)

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Post by mrbonzai211 » Thu Jul 26, 2007 4:06 pm

It is never a good idea to mix species in any sort of tank. In the wild two species of animals are never forced to share the same small space together. It is too stressful on the animals to share such small quarters. Plus, with frogs you can never mix them with anything other then members of their own species because all frogs are somewhat toxic. Tree frogs are especially toxic and will slowly poison any animal sharing the same space with them. This is mostly because tree frogs like to soak in the water at night and poison the water, but even their general presence in the tank will cause the toxic content of everything in the tank to increase.

To sum it all up. It is not a good idea to mix any two species together.
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Post by Guest » Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:57 pm

in addition to what tim, mrbonzai211, said... frogs poop an insane amount and sometimes, more often than not, its a large amount lol.... For this reason as well, it would not be a good idea to put tree frogs with hermit crabs...

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Post by mrbonzai211 » Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:54 pm

One other thing to note, is that frogs often carry salmonella which will infect the tank which will make handling your crabs more difficult. Crabs, as far as we know, don't carry salmonella (or any diseases), but the germs will still infect everything in the tank.
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Post by Guest » Fri Jul 27, 2007 6:04 pm

Dont forget the frogs health aswell, they are one of the worst things to cohabbit with something. As they take in water etc through their skin they need a clean enviroment, need to be kept very clean if kept with other of their own species nevermind with other animals.
Also with tree frogs being toxic i think you are thinking of things like poison arrow or dart frogs and toads which are all toxic to some degree, alot of frogs and tree frogs arnt toxic tho.

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Post by mrbonzai211 » Fri Jul 27, 2007 9:25 pm

clones wrote:Dont forget the frogs health aswell, they are one of the worst things to cohabbit with something. As they take in water etc through their skin they need a clean enviroment, need to be kept very clean if kept with other of their own species nevermind with other animals.
Also with tree frogs being toxic i think you are thinking of things like poison arrow or dart frogs and toads which are all toxic to some degree, alot of frogs and tree frogs arnt toxic tho.
Actually, on top of crabs and tarantulas I also keep a pair of White's Tree Frogs. It is true that all frogs are toxic to some extent. It is also complicated by the way different species react to those toxins. Something benign to us may be extremely deadly to another creature while something toxic to us won't bother something else.
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Post by Guest » Sat Jul 28, 2007 4:28 am

Yeah fair enough that is true diffrent animals will react diffrently to things but to say whites will be to hermits seems very unlikley to me, hard to say unless someone has done a study but id say the hermits would be much worse for the whites that they would be for the hermits.

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Post by Jedediah » Sat Jul 28, 2007 9:40 am

It's just that by no means all frogs are toxic for humans or even to most other animals. But all of them produce skin excretions that other animals inclusing humans may react to. Some species of poison arrow frogs are not toxic for humans/mammals at all and deadly are only Phyllobates terribilis, with some other species there's almost nothing known about their toxins.
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Post by Guest » Sat Jul 28, 2007 10:15 am

Yeah Phyllobates terribilis or Golden Arrow is just the most poisonous frog, one out of a few species that live in the same area. Lots of the others are poisonous from diffrent areas but as its what they eat that makes them poisonous it will depend what diet they rely on in that area. Id guess Golden Arrows are the most poisonous because they are also the smallest so will rely more heavily on the small mites that cause it.
If you keep dart frogs alway get CB so your frogs are safer for you to be around.

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Post by Jedediah » Sat Jul 28, 2007 10:42 am

Captivity-bred poison arrow frogs are not poisonous at all and wildcaught ones loose the toxins after a few weeks. P. terribilis is actually quite big, almost 2 inches - bigger than my D. auratus (who are about one inch long) for example or even D. ventrimaculatus (they are so tiny - really cute :) )
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