Is he suffocating?

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KrankyKrab
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Is he suffocating?

Post by KrankyKrab » Sat Sep 14, 2019 7:19 am

1. What kind of substrate is used in your tank and how deep is it? Flukers Sand and EE, 6" deep


2. Do you have gauges in the tank to measure temperature and humidity? If so, where are they located and what temperature and humidity do they usually read? Current temp 76 (still working on increasing), humid 82


3. Is a heat source used in the tank? If so, what? UTH (previously ceramic bulb)


4. What types of water are available (fresh or salt) and how is the water treated (what brands of dechlorinator or salt mix and what ratio is used to mix it)? Fresh - Prime, Salt - Prime/IO


5. What kinds of food do you feed and how often is it replaced? Fresh, daily: egg shells, carrots, chicken, broccoli eat


6. How long have you had the crab and what species is it, if known? 4 months - unknown


7. Has your crab molted, and how long ago did it happen? Currently


8. What type of housing are the crabs kept in, what size is it and what kind of lid is on the housing? 18x18, mesh covered with Coroplast, Saran under uvb bulb housing


9. How many crabs are in the tank and about how large are they? 2nd just added - pretty big (maybe 1.5 - 2"- working on upgrade


10. How many extra shells are usually kept in the tank, if any? 7


11. Have there been any fumes or chemicals near the crabitat recently? no


12. How often do you clean the tank and how? fresh water changes every second day, salt water bubbler pool changed weekly


13. Are sponges used in the water dish? If so, how are they cleaned? in fresh, boiled weekly


14. Has anything new been added to your crabitat recently? additional substrate to bring to 6" - EE


15. Is there any other information you would like to share that might be helpful (anything that is regularly part of your crab care, playtime, bathing, etc.)?


Ive tossed and turned all night - so upset. I recently came across a post somewhere that stated collapsed tunnels lead to suffocation: My oldest, Mo, came into his new crabitat and ran over to a shell. He copped an adorable feel for a few minutes and sat next to it half the day. I later returned and he was buried. My second, Optimus - which was acquired recently after I learned about the loneliness, was picked out by my son. Pretty big compared to Mo (forcing a tank upgrade sooner than later) and they lovingly huddled together in their death-tat (the dry, calcium sand environment my innocent son thought they needed for two weeks before I researched.) So I feel there is no hostility in the tank.

Mo has been underground for 4 weeks or so. I was slowly learning how to optimize their environment - humidity, heat, depth ect. I needed to add the bubble pool (humidity was scarcely 60!). I dug on the opposite side of where Mo was when I last saw him, and unfortunately, there his shell was- I didn't move it, assuming he was inside it. Im convinced I need to place him in ISO via Tupperware method that Ive been reading here. I don't recall ANY tunnels or empty air pockets around him which means I have probably destroyed his safety and air source. This breaks my heart. I can't believe how many times Ive unknowingly mishandled these little babies before I found you guys. :cry:

Is it worse to take a chance to place him in ISO vs leave him undisturbed? Is it true he could be suffocating??

Thank you so much for your help.
KrakyKrab - now KryingKrab



.

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curlysister
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by curlysister » Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:07 am

To clarify - you came across him when digging to put the new pool in. And he is where you found him still? Did you cover him with anything, or can you still see his shell?

I am thinking that you are correct that you probably need to have a look at him, and iso him at this point.
"If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went." -Will Rogers


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KrankyKrab
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by KrankyKrab » Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:19 am

Correct - I assume he is where I found him, I didn’t touch him. I covered him back up with sub and haven’t peeked since.

And I ASSUME he was in his shell ??


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KrankyKrab
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by KrankyKrab » Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:21 am

Cage still smells earthy - no fish or stench

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DragonsFly
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by DragonsFly » Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:35 am

Covering him back up was the problem. If you inadvertently uncover a buried crab, you should not try to re-bury him, because you can't re-create a molting cave. (Although you don't remember any air space as you were digging, it is possible that there was some, but your digging collapsed it before you got there to see it.)

If it hasn't been too long, you could just try uncovering him again, then either iso-ing him in place (this is the preferable option, if at all possible, as any handling if he is molting is hazardous to him); or if necessary moving him into an iso situation.
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KrankyKrab
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by KrankyKrab » Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:43 am

DragonsFly wrote:Covering him back up was the problem. If you inadvertently uncover a buried crab, you should not try to re-bury him, because you can't re-create a molting cave. (Although you don't remember any air space as you were digging, it is possible that there was some, but your digging collapsed it before you got there to see it.)

If it hasn't been too long, you could just try uncovering him again, then either iso-ing him in place (this is the preferable option, if at all possible, as any handling if he is molting is hazardous to him); or if necessary moving him into an iso situation.
Ok - I’ll try that.... to iso without touching: undig a little and gently. Blocking off how? Maybe empty water bottle cut both ends so temp and humid is same as tank?


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DragonsFly
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by DragonsFly » Sat Sep 14, 2019 12:15 pm

Yes, the water bottle/soda bottle method is great. You can just cut the bottom off, leave the cap off the top, lower the (now open) bottom of the cut-off bottle over the crab. Anchor the bottom in the surrounding substrate so it can't just easily be tipped off by another curious crab. This should keep other crabs from bothering the iso'd crab, while allowing him to stay in the same conditions.

If he is in fact molting, darkness is important, so using a dark green soda bottle and providing some other shadowing mechanisms might be good as well, if you can.
--{}: Dragons Fly Farm --{}:
Resident PP's:"Major Tom" "Billie Jean" & "Mr. Jones"
MT and BJ jumbos now. Everybody excited to move somewhere warm and beachy.


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KrankyKrab
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by KrankyKrab » Sat Sep 14, 2019 1:13 pm

DragonsFly wrote:Yes, the water bottle/soda bottle method is great. You can just cut the bottom off, leave the cap off the top, lower the (now open) bottom of the cut-off bottle over the crab. Anchor the bottom in the surrounding substrate so it can't just easily be tipped off by another curious crab. This should keep other crabs from bothering the iso'd crab, while allowing him to stay in the same conditions.

If he is in fact molting, darkness is important, so using a dark green soda bottle and providing some other shadowing mechanisms might be good as well, if you can.
Dragon ... I very softly dug down and found him BUT I place my finger around and felt TWO pockets! The pic isn’t great but he looks halfway buried and molded into sub but where those white lines I drew are pockets or tunnels. So I left it open like this pic instead of adding bottle. I guess he fixed my destructive attack. When I saw him he was open side down. Now I see a hint of claw in the sub.

What would you do? Still add bottle around? Image


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DragonsFly
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by DragonsFly » Sat Sep 14, 2019 9:54 pm

Yes, because you have another crab in there with him, and if he is molting, you want to protect him from the other crab (a molting crab is an easy and attractive meal for another crab). And again, providing some shelter and shade is a good idea.
--{}: Dragons Fly Farm --{}:
Resident PP's:"Major Tom" "Billie Jean" & "Mr. Jones"
MT and BJ jumbos now. Everybody excited to move somewhere warm and beachy.

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RiNiKy506
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by RiNiKy506 » Sat Sep 14, 2019 10:07 pm

Can you see any exo? Is he soft? If he isn’t soft then you could probably just let him be and he will find another spot or fix his current spot, like you said he may have already.

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DragonsFly
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by DragonsFly » Sat Sep 14, 2019 10:26 pm

RiNiKy506 actually has a good point; if he is moving around down there at all, and you don't see any loose exoskeleton and he doesn't look soft, he may just be able to dig another cave for himself, or may even be about finished with his molt (you said he's been under for a month?). But if he isn't moving much or at all, I'd protect him for a while from the other crab, because he could still be in a vulnerable state. See if he has moved, and if you can see any of his limbs, check to see if he appears to have good, hard exo with spiky "hairs" on it; if so, and if he is moving around a bit, you can just keep conditions good and leave them be.

Has he molted with you before? And about how big is he?
--{}: Dragons Fly Farm --{}:
Resident PP's:"Major Tom" "Billie Jean" & "Mr. Jones"
MT and BJ jumbos now. Everybody excited to move somewhere warm and beachy.

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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by GotButterflies » Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:56 pm

KrankyKrab wrote:
Sat Sep 14, 2019 7:19 am

Hello :) I answered in GB: For GotButterflies in Bold :)

1. What kind of substrate is used in your tank and how deep is it? Flukers Sand and EE, 6" deep

GB: Did you moisten this with dechlorinated fw or dechlorinated msw to make it sandcastle consistency?


2. Do you have gauges in the tank to measure temperature and humidity? If so, where are they located and what temperature and humidity do they usually read? Current temp 76 (still working on increasing), humid 82

GB: If you are trying to increase temp you can insulate the tank. To insulate it, you can put either aluminum foil (shiny side facing inside the crabitat), then cardboard or styrofoam. If necessary you can repeat. Do not cover your UTH if it is a ZooMed Heater. Those are already insulated. If you prefer a different option, I like a product called Reflectix. It looks like a car shade. You can purchase it at Lowes or Home Depot. I huge roll of it is $10-$14. Yuse.ou would use just that to insulate your tank This is what I use. I take it off during the summer, and put it back on during the winter. You would hang all of this insulation using Relectix tape, packaging tape or duct tape. Your choice.

3. Is a heat source used in the tank? If so, what? UTH (previously ceramic bulb)

GB: Make sure this is on the back of the tank above the substrate



4. What types of water are availab ofle (fresh or salt) and how is the water treated (what brands of dechlorinator or salt mix and what ratio is used to mix it)?
Fresh - Prime, Salt - Prime/IO

GB: Do you use a dechlorinator? You need to use something that removes chlorine, chloramine and neutralizes ammonia and heavy metals.

5. What kinds of food do you feed and how often is it replaced? Fresh, daily: egg shells, carrots, chicken, broccoli eat

GB: In my opinion your crabby needs more variety. Make sure you cover all aspects of food pyramid :) Foods should be organic when possible. Hermit crabs are sensitive to pesticides and fertilizers.
Safe food list: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=92557
Unsafe food list: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=92556
Food pyramid: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=92554


6. How long have you had the crab and what species is it, if known? 4 months - unknown

7. Has your crab molted, and how long ago did it happen? Currently

8. What type of housing are the crabs kept in, what size is it and what kind of lid is on the housing? 18x18, mesh covered with Coroplast, Saran under uvb bulb housing

9. How many crabs are in the tank and about how large are they? 2nd just added - pretty big (maybe 1.5 - 2"- working on upgrade

10. How many extra shells are usually kept in the tank, if any? 7

11. Have there been any fumes or chemicals near the crabitat recently? no

12. How often do you clean the tank and how? fresh water changes every second day, salt water bubbler pool changed weekly

13. Are sponges used in the water dish? If so, how are they cleaned? in fresh, boiled weekly

GB: Sponges are not necessary. Take them out of the water. Water bowls should actually be pools that are deep enough for the crabbies to fully submerge in by themselves and safely get out of. A lot of us use tupperware containers.

14. Has anything new been added to your crabitat recently? addit
ional substrate to bring to 6" - EE

GB: Only add one inch per day. Don't move items.

15. Is there any other information you would like to share that might be helpful (anything that is regularly part of your crab care, playtime, bathing, etc.)?

Ive tossed and turned all night - so upset. I recently came across a post somewhere that stated collapsed tunnels lead to suffocation: My oldest, Mo, came into his new crabitat and ran over to a shell. He copped an adorable feel for a few minutes and sat next to it half the day. I later returned and he was buried. My second, Optimus - which was acquired recently after I learned about the loneliness, was picked out by my son. Pretty big compared to Mo (forcing a tank upgrade sooner than later) and they lovingly huddled together in their death-tat (the dry, calcium sand environment my innocent son thought they needed for two weeks before I researched.) So I feel there is no hostility in the tank.

Mo has been underground for 4 weeks or so. I was slowly learning how to optimize their environment - humidity, heat, depth ect. I needed to add the bubble pool (humidity was scarcely 60!). I dug on the opposite side of where Mo was when I last saw him, and unfortunately, there his shell was- I didn't move it, assuming he was inside it. Im convinced I need to place him in ISO via Tupperware method that Ive been reading here. I don't recall ANY tunnels or empty air pockets around him which means I have probably destroyed his safety and air source. This breaks my heart. I can't believe how many times Ive unknowingly mishandled these little babies before I found you guys. :cry:

Is it worse to take a chance to place him in ISO vs leave him undisturbed? Is it true he could be suffocating??

Thank you so much for your help.
KrakyKrab - now KryingKrab



.
Truly blessed to have incredible creatures, wonderful friends and my amazing family in my life!! I'm very thankful & grateful for all of them! www.thehealthyhermit.com


Topic author
KrankyKrab
Posts: 82
Joined: Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:03 am
Location: Staten Island NY

Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by KrankyKrab » Sun Sep 15, 2019 7:45 am

So I checked on him this morn, initially yesterday the small claw peek in his shell looked bright red, but today he shifted a little and his legs look pale (which I read is normal). I didn’t dig around around for exo and never had a molter yet. I assume they stay in shell during molt?

Perhaps he’s just distressing? But I am so glad to know he is alive! AND breathing!


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Topic author
KrankyKrab
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Location: Staten Island NY

Is he suffocating?

Post by KrankyKrab » Sun Sep 15, 2019 7:49 am

Thanks guys - I forgot to add I ESTIMATE a shell opening of 1/2-3/4”.

And I thought Prime was a dechlorinator, GB?

And how can I tell if he is soft? (the molt guide didn’t mention)


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Hermiesguardian
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Re: Is he suffocating?

Post by Hermiesguardian » Sun Sep 15, 2019 9:24 am

KrankyKrab wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 7:49 am
Thanks guys - I forgot to add I ESTIMATE a shell opening of 1/2-3/4”.

And I thought Prime was a dechlorinator, GB?

And how can I tell if he is soft? (the molt guide didn’t mention)


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Yes, Prime is a dechlorinator. I'm sure GB just didn't read that right. Lol
Yes, they stay in their shell to molt. It can takes weeks for them to completely harden. That's why they stay buried for so long.
raising son's dog, Dante. Husky/hound.
Raising daughter's hermit crabs, Shelder, Paras and Derek. Added 2 more of my own (of course) Pete and Stryper. Former mommy to 2 guinea pigs and beloved cat, Nissi

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