sodium citrate?

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 12:09 am

I was looking through the ingredients of my creme cheese so my new babies could have some protein... but it has sodium citrate in it.
Is that salt exactly or is it okay?

MamaZelly · Post by **MamaZelly** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 10:22 am

Since dairy isn't something they'd find in the wild, I'd skip it. Good sources of protein are most meats (unseasoned), seafoods, peanut butter, and scrambled eggs. My guys especially like scrambled eggs!

megs · Post by **megs** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:06 am

Dairy is NOT bad. That was one of those common myths like citrus being toxic or PPs not needing salt water. Cheese or milk are good for an occasional feeding.

Sodium citrate isn't salt in the way you're thinking, but it is a preservative. It's in a lot of food & beverage products including non-cola sodas like Mountain Dew. It's also used in laboratories as an anticoagulant.

MamaZelly · Post by **MamaZelly** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:13 am

I didn't say that it was bad...just that I wouldn't give it to my own little guys. In the wild, they'd be much more likely to stumble upon a dead bird or a washed up fish than a brick of cream cheese

I don't want to start anything, it's just my own opinion.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:13 am

Well I'm just being a wiseguy here (so no offense MamaZelly) but would they find chicken, pigs or cows where they live or scrambled eggs in EVOO or peanut butter? I'm not a big fan of dairy for any animal (peoples included, though I couldn't ever give it up 100%) but I don't think they should be bound by what they might find in their habitat.
I know I wouldn't want to live only on what might be found in Massachusetts (no pineapple!!)
One of the other boards (Epicurean hermit maybe) has tested dairy and it seems to be safe, though.

From Wikipedia:
Sodium citrate usually refers to trisodium citrate, though it can refer to any of the sodium salts of citric acid:

* Monosodium citrate
* Disodium citrate
* Trisodium citrate

It sounds benign though I can't say for sure.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:16 am

megs wrote:Dairy is NOT bad. That was one of those common myths like citrus being toxic or PPs not needing salt water. Cheese or milk are good for an occasional feeding. ...

Yup. Last night was "dairy" night for my clan. They get a small piece of cheese every 3-4 weeks and they LOVE it. It's always devoured. Some crabbers have food journals that they keep. I read through them on a regular basis and have yet to come across a single one that believes dairy to be unsafe to hermit crabs.

megs · Post by **megs** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:22 am

I wasn't starting anything with you. I was merely countering a popular myth and stating what's been tested and proven. I wanted to clear up some misinformation for others.
If you choose to believe otherwise, that's your choice, but others will disagree and I want them to have that choice.

I would stick with a less processed dairy product that cream cheese though.

MamaZelly · Post by **MamaZelly** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 12:38 pm

luvmycrabs wrote:Well I'm just being a wiseguy here (so no offense MamaZelly) but would they find chicken, pigs or cows where they live or scrambled eggs in EVOO or peanut butter?

Point taken!

However, I don't feed them beef or pork, myself. Maybe an odd cow would wash up now and then, but not likely!!

I figure chicken or turkey would be okay, since birds do die and fall to the ground in the wild. Granted, not chickens and turkeys

but I'm not about to go searching the neighborhood for dead birds...

Eggs, yup, they'd find eggs, though not scrambled and cooked. I'm just not going to put raw eggs in the tank. Ick... But they do get the shells when I've used eggs in the kitchen.

blaze88 · Post by **blaze88** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 6:30 pm

well its most likely safe, we know that dairy is, but would it be a good source of protein, the awnser is no.

The amino acid (type of protein) in milk based dairy is lactose. Only baby mammals and some adult humans (usually of European origin) can digest this protein. Crabs, are neither. Although it defiantly will not hurt them, it will not give them any protein either.

Sodium citrate should probably be ok, but I am not 100% on that.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 5:50 pm

well not to stir the pot... BUT... on this island, where crabs live in the wild, there are cows, pigs, goats, sheep, chicken, monkey, geese and wild birds, there is also a garbage dump, which I haven't visited but it's probably a safe assumption that it's probably a favourite hangout for crabs.

Lactose is also a sugar, so it's a good source of energy

The protein in milk is casein, whey and lactoglobulins. Lactose is a dimer (2 molecules stuck together) so it's a simple sugar and can probably be broken down by the crabs if they have any generic exosaccharidases (enzymes which can cleave outer bonds) or if they can use dimers instead of glucose monomer. The problem with people is that we don't have generic enzymes we have specific enzymes and can only absorb monomer, not dimer, that's why when your body decides to stop producing lactase (like mine

) you become lactose intolerant, meaning you can't break down the lactose and absorb it.
Phew, that's all from me, I'll take off my physiology-nutrition hat now and crawl back under my anatomy rock to study

Kilimanjaro · Post by **Kilimanjaro** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:04 pm

blaze88 wrote: The amino acid (type of protein) in milk based dairy is lactose.

Isn't lactose the sugar in milk (just like there are glucose, sucrose, and fructose)? I think the protein in milk is called casein.

Personally, I wouldn't want to give my crabs any preservatives, so I would go for a more all-natural cheese. And also, it does not matter where crabs get the protein from. What matters is that they get the necessary amino acids that they need to live.

*Edit: Just read the post above me, and it turns out, I seemed to be correct.

I guess that's what a year of Biology does to you. :roll:

blaze88 · Post by **blaze88** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:39 pm

Ahh, Im sorry I confused Lactose with Casein! sorry for the confusion.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Jul 03, 2008 9:34 am

And not everyone who has issues with milk has it with the lactose, btw.

I'm not lactose intolerant, but I sure as heck am allergic to milk. lol LINK It's Wiki, but it's the first thing I could find. lol