Humane euthanasia?

[moonshermies]

Update? Been following this thread. Hoping she is doing better.

Same here, hows the lil crab doing?

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[Drakezilla]

They've got so many weakness and sensitivity issues and it's so hard with them to know what the best move is.

My big guy has been thought dead so many times and bounced back miraculously in ways I'm only forever grateful for.

It's hard and it's heart breaking. I'm crossing my fingers for her!

I really hope it's just a molt and with ISO time and tlc she will be fine!!

[lulaagrl]

Hey everyone. Unfortunately she was not molting and did actually lose the legs. I have been force feeding her with a Q tip and have been finding her eating on her own, but she has continued to decline. We have found her naked twice and had to put her back in the shell. The rest of her legs have started to shrivel up so I think she is going to drop them soon too. I wonder if this can be caused by dehydration? I made a fruit smoothie for her and have been giving her that trying to keep her hydrated and she has been eating that along with apple pieces. I just don't know what else it could be. She did have mites and we got rid of them but I don't know how long she had them - it could have been them. And her last surface molt which went all wrong.

Meanwhile I have been calling vets and most of them won't do euthanasia or want to do anesthetic gas for euthanasia which of course won't work. The closest to humane was the vet I talked to last week who could use anesthetic gas followed by an injection of the stuff they give to euthanize dogs and cats. I know the gas won't work but would the injection work if it wasn't straight to the brain, or would it cause more suffering? I just hate to have her go on and on like this - pretty soon she is going to be legless and it is so heart-breaking to watch. I just wonder how much pain she is in.

[annopia]

it is possible that euthasol (the euthanasia solution used in dogs and cats) would work. it is thought to work on gaba receptors, which researchers think are involved in inhibitory nerve signals in crabs. but i don't think there has been enough research on it to know for sure (i think the current recommendation is potassium chloride injections for crabs). i'm sad to say (as a secondary year student in veterinary school), that veterinarians are taught essentially nothing in school about crabs or other arthropods. your best bet would be a veterinarian who does work with aquatic animals, because they may have some experience with crabs. however, i don't think euthanasia is widely used in aquatic veterinary medicine. they would likely know of a way that crabs in general could be anesthetized, however (making a potassium chloride injection less stressful).

as far as dehydration goes...i think that shell water plays a large part in keeping crabs from getting too dehydrated, but i don't know for sure. if you have reshelled her and there wasn't any water in the back of the shell, it might be worthwhile to drip some back there.

so sorry you're going through this. i know from first hand experience how painful it can be to watch a beloved crab slowly fade away.

Caroline

[lulaagrl]

We just found her outside her shell again, this time with her butt sticking in the water dish, so I think you are right. We decided to fill her shell with water and stick her back in it. If she gets out again and goes back to the water dish, maybe we should just leave her and let her figure it out. I think she must be severely dehydrated despite our efforts of spraying her and giving her liquid-filled food. So many things we could have corrected earlier before it got to this stage.

I called a few aquatic vets and was told the same stuff, unfortunately. Just left a message with our local aquarium for advice here too..

[Cydonia1]

I'm just throwing this out there, but would clove oil to numb the head or just soaking the crab in it when its naked and obviously really far gone, then destructing the brain work? I dont know if crabs react to the numbing of clove oil but I know it works for fish euthanasia. I don't know how you'd measure how much you need to tell if the crab is numb enough, and I'd thinking that blunt force would be kinder when you dont know, and less traumatic on the person. You COULD decapitate (where at exactly though?) then use the pithing method, but I think numbing to the best of your abilities then using a brick to crush the whole front halve would be nicest, especially if you can't find a quick enough option with a vet

Here's an anatomy chart that might help if you decide to go with this method
http://www.gbri.org.au/Portals/0/Images ... natomy.jpg

[CallaLily]

I'm so sorry she's not improving. Definitely get her reshelled if you can. Unfortunately, from what I've seen, I don't think soaking naked in the water dish is a very good sign.
:grouphug:

[annopia]

try not to be so hard on yourself, you are doing the best you can and more than a lot of people could or would. in a situation like this its normal to look back and think "maybe if i did x or y it would of helped/saved them." but the reality did is you did everything you could think to do with the knowledge you had, and that is all anyone can do. i know it might not feel like it right now, but the reality is you are going above and beyond what most owners would do. i'm in almost the exact same situation right now with one of mine, and i know how crushing and frustrating it can be. you love them, and they are fading away despite your best efforts. and even if ultimately she doesn't make it, you will have made her last days much more comfortable than they would have been without you. you made her special food and put it close to her so she could eat it. that means that despite the pain she may be in, because of something you did she is not hungry, and feeling at least a little bit better because of that. i know its hard, especially when you feel so helpless, but try to keep that in mind.

Caroline

[lulaagrl]

It sounds like the method above would work, but I'm afraid I don't think I could bring myself to do something that seems so drastic and destructive...

Thank you Caroline for that comment. That is one of the nicest things I have ever heard and I am going to store that away always to lift my spirits in situations like this.

[lulaagrl]

For those interested, here is a response I got from a wildlife vet acquaintance I have that I reached out to. I am not sure if I can get a hold of these substances myself, but in case anyone finds this useful I wanted to share.


The method that I have used for invertebrates involves first inducing anesthesia using Magnesium Chloride (Dead Sea Works has a commercially available MgCl2 solution) and then either soaking in, or injecting, potassium chloride which will cause cardiac arrest. MgCl2 causes loss of sensory input, which will prevent any suffering of pain from Potassium chloride and the injection. Other solutions have been used extensively, including Finquel and Eugenol mentioned below. These are also considered humane, but potassium chloride is the solution that I personally feel the most comfortable with because it is the simplest in terms of its composition and impact on the nervous system, and therefore is the easiest for me to predict and understand. It also is not a controlled substance and is therefore fairly easy to obtain.

What I would recommend doing is first anesthetizing the animal by soaking it in a solution of water containing 50 grams of magnesium chloride per Liter of water. Once the animal is relaxed it should be easily extruded from its shell and manipulated without responding – this may take up to 30 minutes, so be patient. At that point you know the animal is not conscious or processing pain and it is safe to administer an injection. Would you happen to have access to a needle and syringe? I've attached a diagram of the animal's anatomy. The heart (as you can see in the picture) is located at the back of the shell. This is the area you should be aiming for if you choose to administering an injection. You will have to search for a soft spot around or below the animal's mouth where a needle can be inserted. The concentration that has been proven to cause cardiac arrest in lobsters by injection is 330mg KCl/ml of water.

[wodesorel]

Potassium Chloride is in every grocery store as a "salt substitute". Magnesium Chloride is sold as a supplement. You may be able to find both as supplements, but I take both Potassium and Magnesium myself for leg cramps and I checked the bottles and neither is the chloride type so check labels. They're also available OTC from lab supply companies. They are not a restricted product, but I'm not sure about the purity or how to make a completely dissolved solution. Needled syringes can harder to get. Most pharmacies require a prescription, but you can purchase them at any place that sells animal vaccines and medications. Tractor supply carries them. There are a ton of online places as well. Find a small enough needle might be the challenge. Possibly a diabetic syringe would be the best bet.

I've had crabs come back from the brink before, so I always give them the benefit of the doubt and let them do their thing. While they've been proven to remember discomfort, we really don't know what level of "pain" they experience and if it's the same kind agony that we mammals go through. Given their regenerative capabilities, I would hope that they have a different experience, since they can grow back missing parts of their bodies given enough time. She's still eating which is great. She's ditching the shell to wander but she may be thirsty and a heavy shell is a hard thing to drag around.

Are you placing her in the water dishes three or four times a day? They are completely capable of drinking with no limbs. I would put Sunshine (my mangled crab) in a 1/4 inch of saltwater, and then again with freshwater for around 10-15 minutes at a time four times a day, walking out of the room while she was in them. She would drink a lot during that time.

[lulaagrl]

Hey everyone, she has finally passed. I will wait for the fishy smell, but there is absolutely no movement today and I can't see any movement in her gills either. I am just glad that this whole agonizing experience is over for all of us. Thank you all so much for your encouragement and advice through all of this.

[KellyCrabbieLove]

I am so sorry you had to go through this and lose a beloved pet. I am relieved to know she is out of her misery. Poor baby.

You did all the right things and made her last days the best they could have been. You are an amazing owner and she was lucky to have you.

[YYWW]

Sorry for your loss


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[CallaLily]

I'm so sorry.