HCA: Hermit Crab Association

Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 1:30 pm**

Just a while ago, I decided to dig up my crab to see how he was doing because he's been under for about a month now. And so I found him and I gave him a kick look and saw he didn't have part of his leg. I put him down and saw that he started to move. That's when he completely molted but in the process all his left limbs came off. Now he just has two limbs on his right side.

Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:30 pm**

Hiya!
Hopefully we can help your crab.

If you answer the questions below, I an other crabbers will have enough information to make useful suggestions.

Another thing I should mention before we continue is that it's always more risky to dig up a crab than to leave it. I don't want to make you feel bad, but it is very normal for a crab to be buried for more than a month. Unless there is an imediate emergency situation, such as a flood, you should never go looking for the little guys. In the future, ya gots to leave the wee beasties to do their thing - especially since the only way for the legs to be regrown is for the crab to have a successful next moult.

So:

1. What kind of substrate is used in your tank and how deep is it?

2. Do you have gauges in the tank to measure temperature and humidity? If so, where are they located and what temperature and humidity do they usually read?

3. Is a heat source used in the tank? If so, what?

4. What types of water are available (fresh or salt) and how is the water treated (what brands of dechlorinator or salt mix and what ratio is used to mix it)?

5. What kinds of food do you feed and how often is it replaced?

6. How long have you had the crab and what species is it, if known?

7. Has your crab molted, and how long ago did it happen?

8. What type of housing are the crabs kept in, what size is it and what kind of lid is on the housing?

9. How many crabs are in the tank and about how large are they?

10. How many extra shells are usually kept in the tank, if any?

11. Have there been any fumes or chemicals near the crabitat recently?

12. How often do you clean the tank and how?

13. Are sponges used in the water dish? If so, how are they cleaned?

14. Has anything new been added to your crabitat recently?

15. Is there any other information you would like to share that might be helpful (anything that is regularly part of your crab care, playtime, etc.)

Finally: what is happening with the crab now? Is it still in its tank? Is it moving? Has it tried to dig, hide or do anything? Don't handle the crab to answer, just let us know what you can see.

Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 6:11 pm**

1: sand, it's about 7 inch deep
2: yes, it's usually in the surface. Temp is usually at 70, humidity usually 80+
3: I do have a heat source for the tank but I do not use it
4: both salt and fresh is available for all my crabs. I just use bottled water for fresh. And salt water that they sell at Walmart for like $1 for each bottle
5:their feeding schedule is changing the food every two days. Dried shrimp, grapes, apples. Usually fruits. I make sure there's eggshells available to them as well
6: the crab that's in trouble is a pp and I've had him for 6 months
7: he molted once, which was mid January until February 15th.
8: the tank I have for them is a 80 gal tank, there's a glass lid on it. There's 100 pounds of sand
9: 4. Two tiny. One large. One medium small
10: 8, there's probably three extra shells for all size crabs I have
11: apparently roach repellent was fumed in the house hold. But I was told it wasnt gonna harm them
12: I set up my 80gal in March. I haven't cleaned the bedding. I usually just pick up their food
13: no sponges have ever been in the tank
14: about 4 weeks ago I got a crab. But he recently passed from a crab fight about four days ago. The crab that two limbs rn was under at the time of the incident. He didn't even get to meet him
15: I usually put my crabs in a bowl of fresh bottled water every 2 weeks so they can bathe and socialize for about two hours. All my crabs aren't very active, they're usually in their own spot.

Shelby is able to come out of his shell and basically just sit there. He tried moving and he still is. Yes it's still in the tank.I've been watching him to make sure the other crabs don't bother him.

Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 7:24 pm**

Awesome, thanks for the answers...

Okay, my first concern is to look at water. Do you know how walmart's salt water is mixed? If its a hermit branded salt water as opposed to a marine fish salt water, you probably want to stop using it. Premixed hermit salt water is not, generally, made using the marine saltwater mixes, like Instant Ocean or Kent Marine, that saltwater aquarists use for their fish... and that's what the crabs need because of trace elements and such that marine mix contains, whereas 'aquarium' or 'sea' salt won't have that.

Next, most bottled freshwater, unless distilled, is chlorinated. If distilled, the water again is missing the mineral components that fish & crustaceans really need. Using a dechlorinator, like Prime, with tap water is usually the best way to go because it neutralizes heavy metals & chloramines, and your crabs still have access to the disolved mineral salts that they need to be imbibing for good health & bodily regulation. Also, Prime + tap water is just cheaper than buying bottled in the long term.

Its better not to bathe crabs - if they have water pools deep enough to submerge in, that they can climb out of, they don't need to be placed in water once a week. They carefully mix salt with fresh water that they store in their shells. Putting them in water can mess up the salinity they've carefully created.

The next thing I notice is that the temperature is a bit low at 70°. 80° is preferable, and is thd recommended minimum temp, so it might be a good idea to plug in that heater you have. Luckily your humidity looks good.

Have you ever calibrated your hygrometer? They can loose accuracy over time, so you may want to pop your hygrometer in a bag with some salt, just to see how acurate it is at this point - especially if you start fiddling with heat.

Also, regardless of what's being fed, it's always a safe bet that crabs would do better with more variety. They have a crazy- huge variety of food choices in the wild, so the more you change it up for them, the better.

Try some new protein options with your crew, hopefully this will help this guy to build strength for the next moult. He needs all the help he can get, since he has to regrow several lost limbs. Also, lots of calcium (eggshell, cuttlebone, etc), raw (that is, unpasturized) honey, organic just-peanut butter, and organic coconut oil are all good foods to promote healing in crabs.

Do you happen to know the measurements of your tank? I could be wrong, but I don't think 80 gal is a standardized size - so I'm curious about the dimensions you're working with. This has nothing to do with your crab-mergency, I'm just curious, is all.

And I'm not sure (experienced enough) to know whether you want to isolate your crab at this point, but I'd lean towards trying.

Moulting is an intense physical process... the shedding of the exo tself takes only a short time, but hardening off after & getting back to a point where the crab is strong enough to go about its crabby ways can take weeks, or even months. Any exo your crab hasn't eaten should be left with it in isolation - it needs that calcium to develop it's new exo.

Try putting a clean half pop bottle over the crab with his exo, and try to cover it to make it dark. If he wants out, he can dig his way out.

Keep us updated & please ask any questions that come to mind!

Other people will chime in with advice, so check back.

Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 7:27 pm**

Oh man...on a phone, at a ball game. I'll do my best to reply. GB for GotButterflies

PastelGlo wrote:1: sand, it's about 7 inch deep

GB: okay, minimum of 6" or 3 times the height of your largest crab, whichever is deeper. Sand no ee is preferable by most. Mix with dechlorinated marine saltwater or dechlorinated freshwater to make it sandcastle consistency.

2: yes, it's usually in the surface. Temp is usually at 70, humidity usually 80+

GB: okay, minimum temp recommended is 80. I don't let mine exceed 85.

3: I do have a heat source for the tank but I do not use it

GB: you need to

4: both salt and fresh is available for all my crabs. I just use bottled water for fresh. And salt water that they sell at Walmart for like $1 for each bottle

GB: okay, that saltwater glub, is, sorry to say....crap. You need marine saltwater that mimics ocean water. Most of us use instant ocean. Purchase at pet store. You also need a dechlorinator for fresh and marine saltwater. Dechlorinator should remove chlorine, chloramine and neutralize ammonia and heavy metals. Most of us use Prime.

5:their feeding schedule is changing the food every two days. Dried shrimp, grapes, apples. Usually fruits. I make sure there's eggshells available to them as well

GB: make sure you feed organic - crabs sensitive to pesticides and fertilizers. Follow food on safe list. Follow food pyramid.

6: the crab that's in trouble is a pp and I've had him for 6 months
7: he molted once, which was mid January until February 15th.
8: the tank I have for them is a 80 gal tank, there's a glass lid on it. There's 100 pounds of sand
9: 4. Two tiny. One large. One medium small
10: 8, there's probably three extra shells for all size crabs I have

GB: HCA recommends 3-5 shells per crab. I personally recommend more. Please check the shell guide. There are incorrect shells to buy.

11: apparently roach repellent was fumed in the house hold. But I was told it wasnt gonna harm them

GB: yikes. I would avoid this in future. Cover tanks and turn off air pumps in the future.

12: I set up my 80gal in March. I haven't cleaned the bedding. I usually just pick up their food
13: no sponges have ever been in the tank
14: about 4 weeks ago I got a crab. But he recently passed from a crab fight about four days ago. The crab that two limbs rn was under at the time of the incident. He didn't even get to meet him
15: I usually put my crabs in a bowl of fresh bottled water every 2 weeks so they can bathe and socialize for about two hours. All my crabs aren't very active, they're usually in their own spot.

GB: please do not do this. Bathing is an old practice that is extremely stressful to them. They should have pools of dechlorinated freshwater and dechlorinated marine saltwater in their tank that they can fully submerge in on their own, and safely get out of.

Shelby is able to come out of his shell and basically just sit there. He tried moving and he still is. Yes it's still in the tank.I've been watching him to make sure the other crabs don't bother him.

GB: You need to ISO this crab. I will try to address this later- game is getting ready to start. ISO with a 2 liter soda bottle- cut off bottom, push down to subso other crabs cannot get to him. Remove cap for air exchange. Give organic honey, calcium, protein, all in bottle caps - give dechlorinated fw & msw too. Then leave the crab alone. Good luck! Sorry this is short, but my son is getting ready to play.

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Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:43 pm**

I tried this a second ago and somehow all my answers were wiped.... Let's try this again shall we lol. I replied with a D-

GotButterflies wrote:Oh man...on a phone, at a ball game. I'll do my best to reply. GB for GotButterflies
PastelGlo wrote:1: sand, it's about 7 inch deep

GB: okay, minimum of 6" or 3 times the height of your largest crab, whichever is deeper. Sand no ee is preferable by most. Mix with dechlorinated marine saltwater or dechlorinated freshwater to make it sandcastle consistency.

2: yes, it's usually in the surface. Temp is usually at 70, humidity usually 80+

GB: okay, minimum temp recommended is 80. I don't let mine exceed 85.

D- agreed! Minimum temp and humidity is 80/80. I do however let mine have a natural night time drop. So 78 at night and 84 at most during the day... Temps at 75 or below will cause the crabs to slow down and become sluggish.

3: I do have a heat source for the tank but I do not use it

GB: you need to

D- agreed! I addressed this above

4: both salt and fresh is available for all my crabs. I just use bottled water for fresh. And salt water that they sell at Walmart for like $1 for each bottle

GB: okay, that saltwater glub, is, sorry to say....crap. You need marine saltwater that mimics ocean water. Most of us use instant ocean. Purchase at pet store. You also need a dechlorinator for fresh and marine saltwater. Dechlorinator should remove chlorine, chloramine and neutralize ammonia and heavy metals. Most of us use Prime.

5:their feeding schedule is changing the food every two days. Dried shrimp, grapes, apples. Usually fruits. I make sure there's eggshells available to them as well

GB: make sure you feed organic - crabs sensitive to pesticides and fertilizers. Follow food on safe list. Follow food pyramid.

D- they also need vege's and plant matter. They have a food pyramid like us...
Food pyramid: http://www.hermitcrabassociation.com/ph ... hp?t=92554
Safe list: http://www.hermitcrabassociation.com/ph ... hp?t=92557
Unsafe food list: http://www.hermitcrabassociation.com/ph ... hp?t=92556

6: the crab that's in trouble is a pp and I've had him for 6 months

7: he molted once, which was mid January until February 15th.

8: the tank I have for them is a 80 gal tank, there's a glass lid on it. There's 100 pounds of sand

9: 4. Two tiny. One large. One medium small

10: 8, there's probably three extra shells for all size crabs I have

GB: HCA recommends 3-5 shells per crab. I personally recommend more. Please check the shell guide. There are incorrect shells to buy.

D- shell guide: http://www.hermitcrabassociation.com/ph ... hp?t=92552

11: apparently roach repellent was fumed in the house hold. But I was told it wasnt gonna harm them

GB: yikes. I would avoid this in future. Cover tanks and turn off air pumps in the future.

12: I set up my 80gal in March. I haven't cleaned the bedding. I usually just pick up their food

D- all is needed is to remove poo and drug away foods.

13: no sponges have ever been in the tank

14: about 4 weeks ago I got a crab. But he recently passed from a crab fight about four days ago. The crab that two limbs rn was under at the time of the incident. He didn't even get to meet him

D- are u sure he passed because of a fight? It could have been PPS- post purchase syndrome. This is fairly common with newbies and usually doesn't pass until after the 2nd or 3rd successful molt.

15: I usually put my crabs in a bowl of fresh bottled water every 2 weeks so they can bathe and socialize for about two hours. All my crabs aren't very active, they're usually in their own spot.

GB: please do not do this. Bathing is an old practice that is extremely stressful to them. They should have pools of dechlorinated freshwater and dechlorinated marine saltwater in their tank that they can fully submerge in on their own, and safely get out of.

D- most use doubled Tupperware for pools and plastic mesh/canvas as ramps for entry/exit.

Shelby is able to come out of his shell and basically just sit there. He tried moving and he still is. Yes it's still in the tank.I've been watching him to make sure the other crabs don't bother him.
GB: You need to ISO this crab. I will try to address this later- game is getting ready to start. ISO with a 2 liter soda bottle- cut off bottom, push down to subso other crabs cannot get to him. Remove cap for air exchange. Give organic honey, calcium, protein, all in bottle caps - give dechlorinated fw & msw too. Then leave the crab alone. Good luck! Sorry this is short, but my son is getting ready to play.

D- I'll let GB come back to this one later... She can address this better than me!!

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Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:06 pm**

I have a 10gal tank where I can ISO him rn. I'll use the heat source for him. And thank you for addressing the water and etc. I'll plan to buy better quality water and what not. Can someone explain to me more about pps?

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Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:10 pm**

This sticky can explain better than I... http://www.hermitcrabassociation.com/ph ... hp?t=92531

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Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:23 pm**

PPS is short for post-purchase syndrome.

This diagnosis is applied to crabs that perish shortly after being brought home from a pet-store. Crabs can be affected by PPS any time prior to completion of their first successful moult.

Deaths prior to first captive moults are unpleasantly common because of the conditions that crabs are held & transported in after wild capture.

Crowding, mingling of geographically diverse populations (i.e. with different regional disease immunities & parasites), inadequate food/water/heat/humidity/space, and general stress, all contribute to weaken the immune function & damage the bodies of the crabs. Therefore, it is not uncommon for weakened animals to perish in the days/weeks/months after arriving in a new owners' care.

We call the symptoms of the perfect storm of immunological destruction PPS.

Edit - also the sticky, too.

Posted: **Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:26 pm**

Well explained LJJ!

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Posted: **Sat Jun 17, 2017 9:34 am**

I'm sorry that I wasn't able to get back to you last night! We didn't get home until midnight. I was exhausted. I'm glad you have a separate ISO. Give him/her proper setup to mimic tank conditions the way they should be. Then give organic raw honey, calcium (eggshells, cuttlebone, oystershell, coral), protein (crickets, chicken, shrimp, mealworms, krill, plankton) as well as dechlorinated msw & fw. Hopefully the little one will make it. Give him/her a hide, and as tempting as it will be to check on him/her- try to leave alone to minimize stress. Good luck!!!!

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Posted: **Sat Jun 17, 2017 3:19 pm**

Thanks everyone for all the info you gave me!

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Posted: **Sat Jun 17, 2017 5:54 pm**

Keep us updated

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Posted: **Sun Jun 18, 2017 11:37 am**

Hello everyone! Shelby seems to be doing well! I've been feeding him organic honey. I make sure the room he's in is even dark. Heat source is being used. Is there any other food that will help him in this situation?

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Posted: **Sun Jun 18, 2017 1:27 pm**

Just continue with organic honey, protein, calcium, other food pyramid items. Bee pollen is good, so is royal jelly- which is also made by bees

glad to hear Shelby is doing well!

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HCA: Hermit Crab Association

Crab lost legs while molting!

Crab lost legs while molting!

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