My Straw (Perlatus) baby thread

This area is dedicated to the pioneers who have captive bred crabs, and for those who wish to learn more or attempt it themselves. Also for inquiring about the gender of your crabs.
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Curlz
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by Curlz » Sat Jun 29, 2013 5:28 am

If I have understand your statements wrongly, please be sorry!
The German keepers like Curlz who are really hardcore about raising zoea have a great track record, but I think the experience with Nat shows us that while the German method is guaranteed, there are other methods that may work just as well. I admit that in the beginning I thought that any zoea would require pristine water and live food and all that jazz, but Nat's successful raisings changed my mind completely about it.
I only can tell you again, that Nat got variabilis. Variabilis is the ONLY species who only got 2 stages of larvae. They do not need any food in these larvae stages. And it is a short time to transmorph to megalopa. Absolutely different from other species.
The hardest part @ variabilis is to prevent the megalopa from eating each other. In all other species it is the hardest part to get enough food in the 4-5 larvae stages and that the larvae have not problems while molting to each new larvae stage. And this runs for weeks till they change to megalopa.

So please do not compare with other species.


My method is not guaranteed! Absolutely not. :(
Now my 7th experiment is running and only my first try in a kreisel was successfull! (Was experiement No.4)
Even if there are two successfull experiments, it is not as easy as it seems. And there are not really other ways to raise them.
Hermits are close to prawns, shrimps and co. And they all need nearly the same conditions to breed. Even marine fishes or sea horses need nearly same conditions. To breed marine animals is always hard.

So in my opinion and experience, there are no other ways to breed them: A good running small tank (1-5 liter) with a stream, constand heat, good saltwater, enough freshly hatched artima, a little bit of phytoplankton, and cleaning. And not too many larvae. But as you see, I fail even if I do all the things I tell you :(

At the beginnung I thought: there must be an easy way. But now, 7th experiments later, I am sure: there is no easy way.

And at the beginning I did not know that there are sooo many details to be important. I have to learn a lot about marine business, finding good artemia, hatching artemia, phytoplankton, bacteria, stream, moltings of larvae and so on.




@kuza: Same problem here. I have to work and can't feed them every 3 hours by hand. And unfortunately if you hatch artemia seperated in a jar, you have to check often to get the really freshly hatched artemia. Older ones will not be eaten and do not have the protein and stuff the larvae need.


So I decided to use an automatic feeder. (an automat for feeding fishes). It puts the eggs directly into the water. And the artemia can hatch there, so that the larvae can catch them directly (and they do).

In the evening I have to clean the tank carefully and do a water change. And that works, if the eggs, the larvae and the water is ok. But no guarantee.

Important is to have only a few larvae (not more that 100, less is more!). The higher is the chance that all larvae got enough food. And they need a lot.
Last edited by Curlz on Sat Jun 29, 2013 5:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Curlz
and her pinchers

my Hermit Blog http://curlz-crabs.blogspot.de/

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kuza
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by kuza » Sat Jun 29, 2013 5:32 am

the ocean nutrition stuff I linked have artima that don't grow since they are sterile I believe. Do you think that is good? The water should move them around.

And what you explained about only a few zoea is why I'm going to have 4 Jars for them to keep them in smaller clutches.

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Curlz
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by Curlz » Sat Jun 29, 2013 5:43 am

@ kuza: you are talking about http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... atid=16873 ?

these are dead freshly hatched artemia.
They 'flow' a while in the stream and then they sink on the floor. So the larvae have the chance to catch them for a few minutes.
You have to clean the floor several times, to keep bacterias away.

Once open it has to keep clean (it gets moldy ) and has to keep cold in the fridge.
In my opinion it is good for feeding from time to time. It can't be put in an feeding automat, because it gets bad after a while.
And I do not know if feeding in the morning and in the evening is enough.

With my experiments, and with the "wisdom" of the marine animal breeders, there is nothing like freshly hatched brine shrimp for breeding crabs and co.



to use 4 jars with only a few larve is a good idea. Even it is more to clean up.
because of all the work we never built a second kreisel ;)
Love sincerly,

Curlz
and her pinchers

my Hermit Blog http://curlz-crabs.blogspot.de/

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kuza
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by kuza » Sat Jun 29, 2013 8:27 am

I want to build a kreisel tank so bad!! I wish I had the time. Maybe for next years mating season i can build two.

And when doing water changes do I have to be careful cleaning up the bottom? Where do the zoea hang out or molt? Do they sit at the top of the water or bottom of the water at all or do they always float around?

I can easily feed them many times a day, just pop by the tanks during a meeting and drop some food in. As long as it's ok that at the end of the day I can just use my dropper/vacuum to suck up the old stuff at the bottom without fear of killing zoea.

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Curlz
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by Curlz » Sat Jun 29, 2013 4:42 pm

normally the larvae will swimm to where the light is.
In my case the light is above them, to prevent them to get to the floor. The stream helps, too.
With the "Kreisel"-stream they stay in the middle of the kreisel, where no stream is. Or just a little stream.

I do not know where they are in a jar. There is no stream like in my kreisel probably. So I think they will be everywhere.
The molt everywhere. They are like swimming fishes. Never rest, always swimming.

To clean the bottom and the jar, stop the bubbler. Shut down the light. Use a torch or the torch app on your smartphone / mobile or whatever. They will swimm to the light.

I do not know if you ever have draw saltwater out of an aquarium?

Take a hose /flexible tube (something like this: http://www.dhgate.com/product/3-m-pvc-t ... 82952.html) and put a piece of a silk pantihose over one end. This is like a net. When it is close-fitting, the net is big enough to get the dirt, but keep the larvae out.


1. Get a glasbowl that's big enough to catch the water. (Glas because you have to check if a larvae has been catched. )
2. The tube ending (side for your mouth) must be above the waterline. P
3. put the other end (with the pantihose) in the jar on the ground.
4. Draw the water slowly with your mouth.
5. When the water is reaching your mouth, put it in the glasbowl and the saltwater from the jar will runs into the glasbowl.
Have an eye on this glasbowl. And with the other eye, clean the floor and the sides of the jar.

Sometime the pantihose is blocked. Press the tube and the water will stop. You can shake the tube a little bit and the drit will get off the pantihose net. After that you can leave the tube and kepp cleaning.

You can use a dropper aswell, maybe it is easier in a small jar!
After a while the floor and walls get slimy (algae and stuff). This can not be removed with tube nor dropper. We are using a wood skewer with a piece of styrofoam at it. With this skewer we carefully wipe away the slimy things. After that we draw / suck the dirt with tube or dropper - depents on how much dirt is in the kreisel.
Love sincerly,

Curlz
and her pinchers

my Hermit Blog http://curlz-crabs.blogspot.de/

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kuza
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by kuza » Sat Jun 29, 2013 11:13 pm

awesome info, I will be using a large baster (like an eye dropper) like this one:

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Mainstays-Baster/14964949

But it's much larger and can suck up 3 ounces each time I suck up water. And I can cut the end to make it the size I want, I'm going to have 2 ready one with a very tiny opening and one with a much larger opening to secure the panty hose too. I hope I can just change 33% of the water in each jar every day. I guess I'll find out soon in my first attempt :)

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Curlz
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by Curlz » Sun Jun 30, 2013 6:04 am

this looks good!
And it looks like the opening is wide enough to not harm the larvae

I am using plastic dropper in different sizes. I can cut the opening to make the opening bigger.


ah I forget the important thing: Good luck! my fingers are crossed! And I knock on wood :)
Love sincerly,

Curlz
and her pinchers

my Hermit Blog http://curlz-crabs.blogspot.de/

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kuza
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by kuza » Mon Jul 01, 2013 4:11 pm

I'm having a lot of trouble finding the "Ocean Nutrition Instant Baby Brine Shrimp" for order in Canada, I wonder why it's no longer for sale here on a lot of sites.

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Curlz
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by Curlz » Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:26 am

in Germany there are only a few shops where to buy "Ocean Nutrition Instant Baby Brine Shrimp". And it always took over a week to deliver.

But I am lucky to have a marine aquaria shop near my home. Yesterday they confirm to get baby brine shrimp till thursday!

hm can you order some in USA? I do not know ...
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my Hermit Blog http://curlz-crabs.blogspot.de/

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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by hermilove » Tue Jul 02, 2013 7:25 am

Sorry if I'm barging in here, but I love following this thread. :) I'm in the US and online there are a lot of places I can order "Ocean Nutrition Instant Baby Brine Shrimp" I came up with a lot of places with a quick google search. Here's a few that sell jars of it. For Canada they had it on the Amazon for Canada.

These are for the U.S. I think but I am unsure if they ship to Canada or not
http://www.petmountain.com/product/fry- ... hrimp.html

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... agpspn=pla

Amazon.ca link for Canada
http://www.amazon.ca/Instant-Baby-Brine ... ine+Shrimp
Lovely PPs and Little Es

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kuza
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by kuza » Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:58 am

Thanks! And those US sites don't ship to canada for that item and the Amazon.ca has it for 61 bucks, wow, that's a huge markup from the 10 bucks in the US. Still hunting!

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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by hermilove » Tue Jul 02, 2013 10:04 am

This Canadian Aquarium Site is talking about it and they paid about $11 for it...I think somewhere in it they talk about places that would sell it!
http://www.canadianaquariumconnection.c ... php?t=1531
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kuza
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by kuza » Tue Jul 02, 2013 10:36 am

Ya that's from years ago, I'm now finding out that it's illegal to sell in Canada. I think I'm going to be stuck doing my own hatchery now. Ugh!!

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Cecil716
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by Cecil716 » Tue Jul 02, 2013 6:47 pm

kuza wrote:Ya that's from years ago, I'm now finding out that it's illegal to sell in Canada. I think I'm going to be stuck doing my own hatchery now. Ugh!!

Its illegel to sell brine shrimp eggs in canada? I saw some at big Als last week!
Current hermits: About 17 PPs and 3 straws (for now)
A 180-ish gallon tank with two 36 gallon extenstions!
What can I say? I love crabs!

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kuza
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Re: My Straw baby attempt thread.

Post by kuza » Tue Jul 02, 2013 8:22 pm

no no, only the "Ocean Nutrition Instant baby brine shrimp in a Jar" are illegal to import right now. The only few left around are priced for it too at 61 per jar. I dont' want to splurge that much for something that's only good for 6 weeks after opening.

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