VERY Deformed bp??

[Cydonia1]

I checked on the crabs I have up tonight, and one of my medium PP's seemed to be missing his big pincher. But I also saw a chunk of something, maybe he lost a leg???

Got him to extend out his bp is EXTREMELY deformed, I'm not even sure how. There's 0 movement with it, I didn't even see him move it at the joint, there's a very dark color them a drop into a tan color, almost like he degloved it and only grew back the part he lost instead of dropping it. it seemed to have dark edges around it, but it could just be his coloring. The BP is also wayyyyy smaller than it should be, he's a medium and it's the size of my small's little pincher.

And idea on what could have happened? For some reason, which I'd also like help with, 60% of my crabs are loosing their bp's when they come up from molting. There's 16 in an 80gl, with 6 micros,2 E sized EE's, one large/jumbo, and an unknown assortment of small-medium-large pps. (I know at least 3 have been with me a year, so they're mediums) It started back in December, and at first it was only a small guy, then it happened to one of the normal guys, now a third of any crabs that are up don't have a bp.
There's 12-14 inches of sub, top layer of large grain /cocofiber /playsand, and the rest straight playsand. Could it be the E's? neither of them are up at the same time, if they are it's only for a day and one ends up going back into hiding. But I've never had any missing legs, just the bp's. maybe I'm giving too much calcium, so their exo's are to hard? I know the bp's exo is already pretty tough.
Thanks!

[aussieJJDude]

Personally I think that 16 crabs in a 80g is a bit too overcrowded, especially since you have E's. IMO, even 8 crabs would be pushing it (depending on the E:PP ratio).
Could you please fill out this help template; to make sure that your conditions are right? Right now I am swaying towards a diet/mineral/vitamin deficiency of some sort, but we/I need to see what your doing currently.

[wodesorel]

To me, it sounds like you might have a crab on a rampage. They are very soft and vulnerable when they molt, and when a cannibal comes along and tries to attack them, they back into their shell and it's the BP and outer legs that take the most damage. The way you're describing his deformed BP makes me think someone made a meal of it when he was still soft. Try experimenting with different proteins and food items as it could be a deficiency of some sort. Have you checked the tank for flooding? Straight playsand tends to pool water at the bottom, which may have made the half the substrate unusable. I personally don't think you're overstocked at all, but I've had bad experiences with Es so I'd be eyeing up those two as being the problem.

[Cydonia1]

Honesty, I had no plans to own E's, but I realized Kermit was an e so I figured I'd do the right thing and get him a buddy, which he won't even look at. I wouldn't be surprised if it was Disco because he's hardly ever up, and there's tons of holes throughout the tat.

What other proteins should I try? I do head on shrimp weekly, and last month I did a rock crab cluster. Less seafood based protein maybe?
And if it is flooded, what do I do? this is the month where almost everyone's down, this happens every other month. Could I buy a small shovel and change where I've seen a crab come up? Right now it's so heavily covered in the back corner I can only see back there with a light, much less reach back there without ripping everything up, and with how hol-ey it is I can't see when a crab has come up except for seeing the actual crab.
Could I use a heat lamp and dry out portions of the sub? I might be able to flip everything over and sit the CHE on the other side of the tat this year, the sub isn't flooded at all over there (I've check, that's where I put the chia plants)

I'll fill out the template in the next post

[Cydonia1]

1: Playsand, 14-. top playsand/EE/large grit

2: top middle of the tat, humidity is 80-100 and temp is 90

3: CHE in the far corner, with the steel caging over it. I WAS going to buy this: http://www.zoomed.com/db/products/Entry ... RpbmciO30= but it's discontinued in the size I need so I'll be DIY-ing one. And I plan on getting a thermostat for it, if anyone has any recommendations.

4: Instant ocean salt, prime conditioner in tupperware tubs

5: Varies, usually fresh strawberries/pineapples/apples/grapes, dried pineapple/mango/papaya/pear, fresh kale/collard greens/butternut squash/green beans/bell pepper/carrots, hibiscus flowers, chia, dried seaweed, peanut butter and honey, Head on shrimp, rock crab cluster, sardines.

6: little over a year, 13 pps 2 Es

7: They've all molted

8: Glass 80gallon/ 48x28x14

9: 16, one large/jumbo pp, six dime sized pps, 2 Es, 7 small-medium pp's

10: there's plenty extra, but they're all over the tank now so I can't count them. minimum 3 for each crab though.

11: Not that I know of, no.

12: I spray the glass with their mister and wipe it down with a washcloth whenever I think it looks too nasty, that's about it.

13: Nope

14: two new caddies, washed off before adding.

[aussieJJDude]

The only thing I would think of changing is:
- moving that gauge(s) down a bit, you want to read the humidity/temperature levels down closer to their level.
- Maybe look into adding a bit more protein into their diet, the fresh fruit/veggie thing is awesome, but they could be offered some more animal products. Things like unseasoned chicken & beef. To ensure that enough protein is getting into their diet, I offer it every second/third day....
(- IDK if you do have a cuttlefish bone or something similar, but do you offer a 24/7 calcium source? (Just in case ))

But other than that, I don't see anything that stands out too much - besides things that I previously mentioned.

[Cydonia1]

I'll try more protein, should I use more than just seafood protein though? I've been sticking with the shellfish and seafood because I can get a single uncooked, unseasoned shrimp for 30 cents instead of remembering that I needed to set aside for chicken/beef for the crabs (I remember fine AFTER it's all cooked though! :roll: )

And for calcium, I just use Reptical powder l sprinkled onto the food, and there's some mixed in with the EE and moss.

Do you think a UVB light would help anything? I have a spare Reptiglo 10'' I bought for my beardie (Needed a reptiSUN, this way wayyy to bright and blue) and I was thinking of getting creative with a way to mount it to the lid.

[megmaholm]

It never hurts to have a good variety of protein Mine like beef, chicken, pork, etc. cooked or uncooked. Nuts and peanut butter also have protein. If I'm feeling lazy I have a seafood blend for fish that I give. I also have dried mealworms.

I'd try some different sources of calcium, too - some of mine like cuttlebone and some prefer egg shells or oyster shell.

It can't hurt to try UVB. Some people have noticed a difference in their crabs' color and activity, so if you have another bulb give it a shot.

[birdbaby19]

More protein would be good, I use freeze dried shrimp and krill. Also hard boiled egg is a favorite. Also with the freeze dried stuff u can feed it everyday. And raw unsalted nuts.

[wodesorel]

Don't overlook dried insects! Crickets and grasshoppers are cheap and the crabs go crazy for them. Bloodworms too if you're not allergic to them. (If you have trouble with mosquito bites, stear clear.) They're full of not just protein but calcium and other shell building minerals as well.

[Cydonia1]

I bought them a large cuttlebone today, feedstore near me sells them for 79 cents so I might go back and get another one just to be safe. I planned on buying some of the canned river shrimp, they've got the sardines today and I'm going to guy a rock crab cluster later this week to break upfor them. I never thought about using crickets! My beardie gets them, and if you look at them the wrong way they die so I have plenty of dead ones and their shells to throw in there.

If I got rolly-pollies/ pill bugs, would they help clean up the tank of misc food bits? are there any other bugs or bug like things I can ad as a cleanup crew? I live in Florida, if that helps. (certain things are illegal here, like Dubai roaches, and other things I can find outside to toss in)

[megmaholm]

Rolli pollies/isopods are definitely safe/good to add. I plan on starting a colony this summer to add to my tanks. http://hermitcrabassociation.com/phpBB/ ... 26&t=92538 Lots of info there! They help clean up food that the crabs scatter, they don't dig deep, and the crabs can snack on them. All in all, a win-win.