The Salt Debate

[Willow]

Real ocean water could not possibly be a "slow poison" to the hermies or they'd be dropping like flies in the wild. I know that they do usually drink from tidepools, not directly from the ocean, but tidepools are not always diluted. Sometimes they've evaporated a bit, so that the salinity would actually be higher than natural sea water. As long as the hermies have fresh water to balance things out, they'll manage.

And, I know you like the ZooMed product and nothing is likely to change that, so I won't even try, but you are not the only one reading this post. There may be some new crabkeepers reading this, trying to decide what brand of salt water to buy. So, I would recommend, if anybody else out there believes that full-strength ocean water is toxic, that they provide diluted marine salt water instead of a neon-yellow, artificially colored, highly processed product such as ZooMed Salt Water Conditioner. We all realize that processed foods aren't good for us or for our pets, and the ZooMed product is just about the absolute height of "processed".

[Guest]

I use the zoomed stuff but for me it is really not that expensive because i add two tiny bottles of the stuff to a gallon and that gallon could easily last me many months because i only have 4 hermit crabs

[Guest]

That's my scenario as well. Also, I did a little research on the ZooMed stuff: it's 100% backed by the company and actual marine biologists developed the formula. I know all companies say that, but... I don't know. I don't mind it and I have nothing but good things to say about it.

[BAB]

I am not interested in posting my testimony to rock the boat. I wasn't even going to say anything earlier... even started a post once and just logged off without posting. I really hate going against anyone on their preferred crab care.

So with that said I want to make it clear that I am only stating what happened in MY tank. I want everyone to make their own decisions because we all have opinions and no one can make everyone happy. I just like to not make anyone unhappy....

Okay... When I first started crabbing I had PP's and boy did they have a rough road. Wrong regular water, no salt water and so much more. That was only 2 months into crabbing too. I lost 2 of the 3 PP's. When I found E's I got a little smarter. New glass tank and I went on the hunt for sea salt water for them. I bought the ZooMed Hermit Crab Water Conditioner Treatment #2. Over the 6 months that I used that water my PP's seemed fine. Not anywhere near what they are now, but fine. They did molt fine too. My E's on the other hand were dropping like flies, having molt problems, deformities showed up and I think that was the start of my E who is a pre-molt bully (he never found suitable conditions to molt for me at that time and just slowly became a mad crab... maybe... He is getting MUCH better now.) Our favorite E, Susi, molted beautifully for me twice and then died. I do believe that my PP's would not have handled that brand of sea salt water for long either... it's just something about crabs that they seem to survive, but their quality of life is seriously hurt.

Anyway... to wrap this up, I've now been using Catalina's Real Ocean Water (comes in a big box that has a bag inside it with 5g real ocean water... just like it says on the box... Edit: And yes, I did research Catalina's water in several different Reef Forums and here. It is just what is says on the box, not all products are like that though.) Yes, it is expensive. It's more expensive then the ZooMed stuff for sure. I've been seeing a HUGE difference in crab activity and my E's are not having so many issues molting now either. Actually, all my crabs are molting without deformities or taking the long period of time they used to. I have since also changed the size of my tank, offered more foods, lighting and introduced Ruggies and Strawberries to my tank too.

Obviously there's a number of factors at play with crabbies. They are ALL important and tie together. If the crab cannot process the food or water appropriatly, it will not process anything else well either.

Do your research... don't just take the word of the packaging of a product either. If you REALLY want to get to the nitty gritty of a situation, call the company and take your own tests.... or trust someone else who has already done that leg work.

EDIT: By tests, I mean take it somewhere if you don't do them yourself... take a bit of prepared water into many different pet stores for testing (most provide them for free) and definately pick some Reef Fanatic pet stores to do that test.

[troppo]

A few months ago I switched from using water collected from my local beach to using Doc Wellfish brand & I fed thawed-out oysters. A few days later I started having unexplained crabbie deaths with my variabilis(Aussie crabs). There were also alot of molt deformities and deaths including peeled back gill plates and numerous black spots, which prior to making these changes,all of my crabs were having perfect molts with no deaths at all.
For the last few months or so I've not fed anymore oysters(believing that this may have been the start of the problems,or part of it). I also know of another crabber that has had similar symptoms happen with their crabs after feeding oysters.
Have also changed over to using Coral Life marine grade salt containing calcium and magnesium over 1 month ago,and have started feeding organic spirulina and more vitamin C containing foods to boost the crabs immune systems,so they can fight this disease. I believe that the change to the marine grade salt has definately made a difference.
So far 2 crabs have molted without incident,and the general health of the other crabs has improved no end.
I'm trying to document everything that's happened,although I know that 2 successful molts while it sounds great,in the end it's a long-term thing.

[Willow]

I am also using Catalina Real Ocean water....I looked up the company and it sounds great, just filtered sea water, nothing added. I have done some calculations, and I think it is actually less expensive than the ZooMed product, as I pay $9.99 for 5 gallons of Real Ocean, which comes to about $2.00 a gallon, and the ZooMed stuff is about $3.00 for a small bottle, which (if I remember correctly) makes less than a gallon if mixed according to the directions. Anyway, I've had great success with Real Ocean, especially with my Straws. The Es are happier, too. I guess you can't improve on nature. I suppose if I could get sea water direct from the ocean, I would, but I live about 1500 miles from any ocean, in any direction . Real Ocean is probably safer than direct-from-the-ocean sea water, anyway, since it's been filtered.

[starmaiden]

I tried the Catalina brand, but I found the 5 gallon jugs to be too unweildy, so I switched to Oceanic and am mixing it 1 gallon at a time. It's easier for me to handle. I've not had any molt deformities yet, but I've only had my Es, which are a really salt water dependent species, for about 2 months, so it's too soon to tell for them.

[Willow]

Yeah, the 5g bag-in-a-box is a real pain. I've been setting the box on the table, then using aquarium airline tubing (1/2 inch diameter) to siphon the water into a 1 gallon jug on the floor.......works OK, and it's a lot easier than trying to pour from the box. I've heard Oceanic is a pretty good brand, so you should be fine.

[Guest]

I'm using Oceanic too, and thought I might switch to Real Ocean next time I need to buy. Hmmm....may be not.

[BAB]

Yay!! I'm glad to see so many others using the Catalina's! I was beginning to wonder if I was the only insane... well... extra insane one on here buying already prepared water.

One way I get around the whole box issue is that when we bring the box home we distribute it into different containers. I REALLY want to get one of those distilled water containers that are like a square but have a tap on it. You press a button and the water comes out. (I hope that discription makes sense.... hehe...)

Right now I use just big square 2 gal distilled water containers that just have a lid. I shake 'em before I suck water out of 'em with a huge turkey baster thing. Hehhe.... I use a filled squirt bottle (has to be rinsed on occassion or it does build up sea salt) for any "daily" maintenance of fluffing moss and whatnot that I need to and to refill the water dishes.

[Guest]

I used CoraLife for a year and now have used Oceanic for over a year. I first used the small bags which were only a few bucks, very economical for a few crabs, lasted a long time.

Many hermit crab species spend plenty of time near salt water sources that are at or above sea water salinity levels. And all of them can regulate their shell water salinity unless the salinity of their salt source is overly diluted. (One reason I don't bathe the crabs on a regular basis, they do this themselves with adequate depth of water in the dishes.)

My straws (I've had for over two years) have molted several times each and soak in the salt water pond regularly. My oldest ruggies (I've had one 32 months and one 30 months) have molted more times than I kept track of, their only molting mishaps at the claws of other ruggie tank mates. All the PP's I have had have molted successfully, other than a bent leg; I've had them between 12-19 months. Indo molts successful (3 crabs, 13-26 months with me), except for one that surface-molted shortly after I brought her home. My highest molting mortality has been with E's, but I don't think it has any relation to salt water, as they died under the sand soon after purchase. When I see E's, they are usually in the most horrid dry conditions in Mom&Pop pet stores, and I feel compelled to take them home. So I think that PPS has more to do with it.

Overall, I've had dozens of molts, very few deformities, a few molting deaths. No science. But plenty of experience, and not a small sample size (ah, the power of statistics)!